tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6507800424207531930.post6869583587306515753..comments2023-09-28T08:39:54.563-07:00Comments on Backseat Driver: First and Second Shifters in the Organic MovementKatiehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13972050713200044461noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6507800424207531930.post-33093056819643950162010-05-30T17:45:48.520-07:002010-05-30T17:45:48.520-07:00Thanks Sharon!!! My privilege to help you in any ...Thanks Sharon!!! My privilege to help you in any way I can, even if it's from a distance!Katiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13972050713200044461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6507800424207531930.post-64532606511148239892010-05-30T15:57:55.545-07:002010-05-30T15:57:55.545-07:00As a relative "newbie" to the organic/si...As a relative "newbie" to the organic/simple church paradigm, leaving IC about 9 mths ago (years ago in heart), I SO appreciate your posts, Katie. Thanks so much for sharing your story and insights.Sharon Outlaw Hillamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17450655759861994356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6507800424207531930.post-71301990064145054132010-05-27T08:39:09.690-07:002010-05-27T08:39:09.690-07:00As always Michael, I love your comments and challe...As always Michael, I love your comments and challenges. Missiorganic huh? Love it!!!<br />(I may borrow it from you brother!!!!)<br /><br /> I personally, am not interested in the "movement going viral" - which may seem like a horrible comment for me to make by some - <br /><br />I truly believe that God will build His Church, His Bride, His Body in whatever way and form He wants. If it "goes viral", its solely because of HIM, and not because of a form, or lack of. It's all about HIM, nothing else - <br /><br /> However, simple church "forms" are far less burdensome and much easier for "going viral"than traditional forms. Look at China, India, the early church in Acts. <br /><br /> I, personally, want to be obedient to "build up, build up, prepare the way, remove every obstacle out of the way of My people" Is 57:14 <br /><br />So that EACH person can be released and empowered to God's purposes - not just the few chosen professionals. The organic, simple, missional movement is that to me - each person fulfilling their destiny in Christ while on earth.<br /><br />I make a lot of effort personally, with those folks I work with NOT to condemn the traditional church. However, the very fact that you LEAVE it has some connotation of that to it, no matter how hard you try to keep that from happening. We are one family - however extended we may get to be -<br /><br />May the Spirit keep us as OneKatiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13972050713200044461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6507800424207531930.post-90637623455548765792010-05-27T08:02:12.979-07:002010-05-27T08:02:12.979-07:00I believe in order for the Organic movement to go ...I believe in order for the Organic movement to go viral it needs to drop any semblance of a "chip on the shoulder" against the institutional church. We don't do organic or missional because the other group is doing it wrong. We do it because the Spirit leads us to.<br /><br />Having a critical eye for this movement, I am impressed by some, turned off by others, and waiting to see. My goal is not to be "organic" or "missional," but to be in tune with what the Spirit is doing. <br /><br />Right now I exist in the happy world of "Missiorganic" (my term)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00127896491196953382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6507800424207531930.post-84207226407540721752010-05-25T17:05:29.913-07:002010-05-25T17:05:29.913-07:00Absolutely Tim, I think first shifters can "g...Absolutely Tim, I think first shifters can "go back in",so to speak, but I believe that is quite a challenge. <br /> One of the issues that many denominations will have to deal with especially, is the issue of paid/professional clergy, simplifying from the traditions, and a gluttony of programs. Pretty tough!<br />Many in the Southern Baptist, Foursquare, and a few other groups are starting to adopt s/o/m paradigm; but it remains to be seen how much of that really results in organic/simple/missional expression, or as Felicity mentioned, just "re-naming" the same ole stuff with the terms. That's some of what I will be talking about next. <br /><br /> Thanks for your great questions and comments Tim - keep em coming!!!!!Katiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13972050713200044461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6507800424207531930.post-13527390186068297812010-05-25T14:31:46.481-07:002010-05-25T14:31:46.481-07:00I'm also looking forward to your next posts on...I'm also looking forward to your next posts on this, Katie.<br /><br />And I'm wondering if the first-to-second shift dynamic may in fact play out multiple times. I'm of the Lutheran tribe and it's clear to me that among us we have yet to see much happening even in terms of first shift exploration of house church forms. (I personally find this ironic, frustrating and just plain sad since Lutheran theology has a deep alignment with simple/house forms that should make this a natural move for us.)<br /><br />I wonder, in your experience are you seeing repeated, if delayed, occurrences of first-shift explorations arising in different groups?<br /><br />Or maybe it's something more like this: perhaps the initial bands of explorers tend to be - for whatever reasons - moving <i>outward</i> from their prior communities into the frontier, followed by the second-shifters as you described. But in addition there are first-shifters who travel <i>inward</i> to sort of re-seed their own communities, or maybe to recruit traveling partners for the next outward mission. I suppose you could also see the inward explorers as a different kind of second-shifters for that matter.<br /><br />Just musing...<br /><br />TimFeral Pastorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02751771814051685510noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6507800424207531930.post-13509208346719439592010-05-24T15:48:04.512-07:002010-05-24T15:48:04.512-07:00Katie,
Another great post! When we first started ...Katie,<br /><br />Another great post! When we first started in simple/organic church a decade or so ago, we could have never dreamed that we would be where we are now in terms of the numbers involved.<br /><br />There are definite challenges to becoming mainstream. For example, churches may change the name of their small groups to house church because it is now a popular term, but without any change in their DNA.<br /><br />I look forward to seeing your next post on the subjectfelicityhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14048306748331963334noreply@blogger.com